ADVENTISM'S PERPLEXITIES ANSWERED, PART IV

About Sealed Discussions:

WARNING! The rest of this page below contains information that is sealed off from the Truth of Adventism Defended Forum. This means that no discussion is to be brought against the points proven in most of the links below. Those with this designation will be clearly marked. Any subscriber who brings up the points which have been disproven in the following list of discussions will be likely regarded as an offender and can be unsubscribed. We had to do this for we discovered that we were dialoguing with unscrupulous members of the papal army. Even after conclusive points were presented to the point where they dared not answer them, they continued to present their redundant points and merely mocked our questions away or laughed at them. We therefore have to institute this principle so as not the waste the time of the people.

The only way discussion upon these points can be brought up again is if the argument(s) are wholly unique in character. All challenges must be issued by applying directly to the owner of the forum, Mr. Ted McMillan:

tmac1238@seventh-dayadventism.com.

I have read Mr. G's response and sum-up of the issues. As was stated before Mr. G puts a difference between the Disciples of Christ and Ellen White. His scripture tells us that a prophet who prophecies and the prophecy does not come to pass has not been sent by God. He then makes a difference by stating that a prophet can prophecy and be wrong, but when that prophet has a VISION from God stating something and is wrong, that is another story.

Notice that the scripture does not say "the prophet who prophecies FROM A VISION." That stipulation is not in the Scripture. The Scripture can therefore be applied to the Disciples. They prophecied AND WERE WRONG! Mr. G argues that because the Disciples of Christ did not have a vision unlike Ellen White, they were not false prophets, but Ellen White definitely is. But yet did Ellen White receive a vision that told her emphatically that "Christ was coming in 1844?" We can see the answer to that is no, and she stated so herself.

Yet Mr. G claims that the Disciples did not have a vision. How does he know that? True it is not recorded that they had, but that does not mean that they didn't. We have communications media and records more advanced than back in the days of the Disciples. The record of those times were also preserved by the friends of the Disciples. They didn't have "Christ-centered" enemies who would preserve the errors and mistakes and then quote us about "unconditional love" and concentrating only on what is lovely and of good report. The Mystery of Iniquity didn't exist back then.

Yet I will state plainly that I personally agree with Mr. G that they didn't have a vision concerning what they were teaching and preaching back then.

We can therefore more understand the mysterious ways in which the Lord works by taking this example from the bible. CHRIST WAS RIGHT THERE, and therefore could have cleared things up for them. His efforts to do this as recorded in Scripture were, as were termed by Mr. G regarding another situation, "lame and weak." He could have done much better and could have sought the advice of Mr. G who would have solved that problem if he was there. Mr. G has been unrelenting in determining to prove that the Adventist Movement is false and that Ellen White is a false prophet. He is so determined, that he can hardly post one article which does not focus on what he claims are the errors of the movement. He posts with emotional invectives and often uses capital letters in order to demonstrate his supreme contempt for the movement. The question therefore was why Christ allowed their misconceptions to remain unlike the strident efforts of Mr. G in trying to continually prove to us that Ellen White was a false prophet, and Adventism is false worship? The same could be asked about the Millerites.

Let us think for a moment and ask the question, what would have happened if Christ had revealed the day and hour of His Second Coming at the time He was resurrected? What kind of effect would that have had on the people throughout the Christian era? From this question we can get a basic understanding of the issue of time when it comes to the Second Coming. Christ was determined to keep these things in the dark.

We know very well what would have happened. To live in Christ's day and then believe after His resurrection that He would return after the year 2,000 would cause many to slump back, and instead of being serious about the day and about eternal interests, it would cause them to do virtually nothing but CELEBRATE all day long. By putting the awesome day in the dark, Christ has commanded more FEAR into His servants.

Now remember that there were posts on this forum that condemned "fear-based messages." The very fact that Christ shrouded His Second Coming in clouds was meant to make it a "fear-based message," in line with the judgments of our enemies. Whenever the subject of the Sanctuary came up, the Israelites were taught to regard it with fear, even though their loved Commander dwelt inside. Yet this decision of Christ and His Father to keep the day and hour of His return secret has resulted in many more people being saved than would otherwise have been.

What then about the Scripture given us in 1 Peter 4:17 where it tells us that the time is come for judgment to begin at the house of God? It apparently tells us that the judgment already begun in the days of Peter. Is that a false prophecy? If you think so, again I ask, the fact that at least four times in the book of Revelation Christ Himself PROPHECIED that He will come "quickly," is that a prophecy that failed? If that prophecy failed, according to the despotic judgments of Mr. G, what does that make Christ?

Oh sure, some would jump up immediately and state, "But remember that the scripture tells us that with the Lord a day is as a thousand years and a thousand years as one day!" (2 Pet. 3:8). But also remember who Christ was talking to. He was talking to finite beings who needed an accurate understanding of what was going on. If Christ tells me that the Seventh-day is the Sabbath, I don't expect to use 2 Pet. 3:8 to disobey that command for the rest of my life with the excuse that the correct millenium had not come. Neither would I be excused for doing absolutely no work for the rest of my life because, according to me, the Sabbath millenium is here.

We can answer this question in another way by examining a parallel scripture which would give us more insight. The Scripture is 2 Cor. 6:2:

For he saith, I have heard thee in a time accepted, and in the day of salvation have I succoured thee: behold, NOW is the accepted time; behold, NOW is the day of salvation.

The judgment for Peter also started in 1844. However, in another sense, the day of judgment for Peter was in Peter's day. This is so because we don't want to give the idea to Peter, by revealing to him the actual day the judgment is to begin, that since it is far off, he can wait till 1844 to be ready and serious about his eternal salvation. The judgment for him will address his actions while he was in the body at whatever time he lived in earth's history.

Even though the judgment was far off, it would be performed as if it was taking place at the time every person involved had lived. It was therefore made known to all, regardless of when they lived, that they were supposed to be sober, vigilant, circumspect, AND WARY OF THE JUDGMENT BECAUSE THE EYES OF GOD WERE UPON THEM REGARDLESS OF WHAT TIME IN THE HISTORY OF THE EARTH THEY LIVED. When the day of judgment would actually come, their deeds on record, however long ago committed, would be reviewed.

Here therefore is the question: Since we were told that the record of sins in the heavenly sanctuary have not been eliminated before the judgment, how is it that Moses and Elijah are in heaven? Does this mean that the record of their sins have been removed? The answer is no.

The record of their sins were still in the sanctuary until Christ had dealt with them in His ministry there. Remember that another purpose of the judgment in heaven is to make sure that Christ's finite creatures also become witnesses to the event so that they can see for themselves His justice in His dealings with His creatures. By Christ allowing His creatures to participate, He is offering a guarantee that sin would never arise again the second time. The book of Revelation therefore tells us that among the finite witnesses in heaven are the twenty four elders. (Rev. 4:4, 10; 5:8, 14, etc.) The judgment for all takes place at one time-even those who are now in heaven. Remember what would have happened to Moses and Elijah had Christ declared that he couldn't drink of the cup His Father had to give Him in Gethsemane. This is sure evidence that the record of their sins had not been eliminated at the time of Christ. If Christ decided not to drink of the cup, Moses and Elijah would have had to forfeit their home in heaven and be forced to bear the guilt of the sins they had committed. They would have been DESTROYED! The fact that they would not have remained in heaven proves that there was yet a record of their sins!